This Scene Has Always Broken My Heart, But The Mod Helped A Little — At Least Now I Can Comfort Him.

"I HATE Ascended Astarion..."

(People are so afraid to face the truth that they came up with a headcanon about losing his soul, which was completely debunked by the developers.)

How I hate Tav/Dark Urge's lines after the ritual. Several rails to choose from, on which they offer you to ride: "I want your body / I want to use you to become a vampire," or creating conflict out of nowhere. Is this an RPG? For heaven's sake, he called you "pet" before. I can definitely feel how I'm being manipulated, but the manipulator turns out to be the writer themself, making sure I don't stray from the path they've set.

Hello, Welch's spawn. I think when it comes to ascension, people tend to make up too much.

«He hides his hurt and insecurities behind that mask of the villain, behind his facade of power and dominance. Under it all he’s still the frightened spawn cowering in the kennels.»

Neil Newbon: We're just using completely different status shift changes as well. So whereas he has a lot of flow and all that kind of stuff and it's theatrical and distracting — it's always 'look over here and don't see how I really feel' with spawn Astarion.

With Lord Astarion, we talked a lot about the idea that the cover is now off completely. So that you see him at his most terrible, and it's completely honest and he doesn't have to pretend anymore. So he loses a lot of the flamboyance and the fun of the theatricality, which is all a distraction anyway. That's all distraction so you don't see how he's hurt and damaged and his vulnerability. Lord Astarion doesn't need that anymore. So we just thought, okay, now mimics taking off a mask it's off. He doesn't need to pretend, he doesn't need to do too much.

It’s no secret Astarion hates himself. Like he deals with a lot of insecurities and self loathing. He just puts on an act of self confidence and narcissism to properly play the role of sexy vampire.

But I think a lot of people miss when he Ascends this gets so much worse. Not only does he still think he’s only good for sex and has nothing to offer beyond that. Now he’s a monster, not by force but by choice. He choose to become a monster. Now he’s expanded his act from sexy vampire to evil sexy vampire. He’s playing the villain because that’s what he thinks he is. And as we know he’s really not that great at acting.

I think it’s interesting everyone always talks about seeing through Astarion’s facade but when it comes to him ascending they’re so quick to fall for his act all over again.

There’s the line “if you stay with him he will always see you as degrading yourself” in his post ascension romance scene. A lot of people interpret it at face value as he hates and looks down on Tav. But I think it’s miss understood because he could never hate Tav as much as he hates himself. Infact I’d say he has Tav put up on the highest pedestal. He sees them as the kindest most caring person in the whole world. He adores them and holds them in the highest regard. That’s why them wanting to be with him so much they would even put themselves beneath him is the ultimate degradation. It’s also why he feels he has to turn them because he doesn’t believe there’s any reason they’d choose to stay with him of their own free will while at the same time he can’t bare to loose them. He can’t wrap his head around the idea that you could actually love a monster like him.

If you say you want freedom in the reunion party he panics. Why would you want freedom? To leave him? You want to leave him? Why? When he’s given you the only things he’s good for; luxury and sex. That’s the only reason you choose him in the first place. He’s desperate to make Tav happy. With out Tav he has nothing. He is nothing.

He hides his hurt and insecurities behind that mask of the villain, behind his facade of power and dominance. Under it all he’s still the frightened spawn cowering in the kennels. And there’s no one he’s more desperate to hide this from than Tav lest they realize their mistake of caring for him and leave.

I wish Tav had dialogue options at this moment like:

I love you.

I trust you.

Tav is literally going to die in a couple of minutes. I want Tav to have the chance to say something before Astarion starts turning them.

Well, in any case, he knows that… Astarion: You are so beautiful... And you will be beautiful forever. Thank you for trusting me.

One of my favorite personal headcanons is that my Dark Urge chooses to become Astarion's spawn to deprive Bhaal of any claim over him. He chooses to give himself to his beloved rather than become a tool of an indifferent deity that uses its Chosen as mere means to achieve its goals. «Wither thou goest, I will go, and where thou lodgest, I will lodge; thy people shall be my people; and because I have no other god and never will, you shall be my god.»

My boys...

So impressed by a tremendous work that Kate Kotova did putting this massive analysis together. Brava!

The community is forever in your debt, Kate!

Ascended Astarion and how he's not like Cazador

hot take good endings only players are really fucking rude to the point that it's actually ridiculous

you don't understand the game, the story, the lore, or the characters better because you prefer the good endings

you don't love the characters more because you prefer the good endings

people who like the evil endings aren't stupid

people who like the evil endings don't like them "just because they think it's sexy"

if you want to know why people like the ending you don't like

you could

just

ask

instead of making shit the fuck up

Fans of Ascended Astarion have consistently faced accusations of romanticizing abuse since the fandom’s inception. After Patch 7, these accusations have only intensified, now directed not only at players but also at the developers themselves, Larian Studios.

And I have something to say about this.

Astarion has become a sort of mirror for players, reflecting their own experiences, personal preferences, and so on. The romanticization of this character is common among almost all of his fans, regardless of which route they have chosen as their favorite. Attachment to this character inevitably involves a degree of idealization and bias in the perception of his actions. Even when Astarion engages in questionable or cruel behavior, fans often tend to find justifications for him.

From the very first moments of the game, Astarion reveals himself as a personality prone to deviant behavior: he manipulates those around him, shows a tendency towards violence, and exhibits a disregard for morality. Yet, despite this, players often interpret his actions from a standpoint of sympathy, seeing them as a result not so much of his character, but rather of his tragic past. As a victim of violence and cruel torment at the hands of Cazador, Astarion evokes a desire to justify his actions, labeling him as a victim of circumstance.

Thus, Astarion's past serves as a powerful justification for many players regarding his dark deeds: instead of viewing him as a cruel manipulator, they see a wounded soul struggling to survive in a world that has always been unfair to him. This desire to find justification and "save" the character "from himself" is intensified by the romantic context of his interactions with the player. Such a perspective often results in the dangerous traits of Astarion losing their edge, creating a more palatable image that fits into the romantic fantasy of redemption.

This undoubtedly contradicts the author's intent, who, when asked what traits are most important for Astarion to "be him," emphasized that Astarion remains a horrible character throughout the game and in many respects. According to the writer, he is prone to violence, revels in blood, and embodies the darker sides of human nature. Astarion is someone who can kill with a smile on his face. Nevertheless, his character is also designed for the player to feel sympathy for him: despite his wicked nature, he must remain appealing and cheerful so that the player wants to have him in their party. The writer likely did not believe that the status of a victim and survivor should serve as an indulgence for the character.

But only fans of Ascended Astarion face accusations of romanticizing him, and I just want to draw your attention to the double standards behind such accusations.

The idea of "fixing" Astarion is a form of romanticization, and this trope, in essence, is indeed a romanticization.

The trope "I can fix him" is one of the popular plot devices in literature, film, and games, especially in romantic storylines where one partner encounters a dark character. In the realm of gaming and artistic fiction, such a trope is not only acceptable but also appealing, as it allows players to experience an emotionally rich yet safe fantasy.

However, in real life, the trope "I can fix him" can be dangerous, as it creates the illusion that love can change a person and resolve psychological or behavioral issues that actually require professional help.

This trope can distort the perception of relationships, creating the illusion that toxic behavior, violence, or manipulation from a partner can be changed by the power of love, attachment, or willingness to sacrifice oneself.

"You were by my side through all of this. Through bloodlust and pain and misery. You were patient. You cared. You trusted me when that was an objectively stupid thing to do."

Here, one might ask: why is the romanticization of the spawn route considered more acceptable? Analyzing both routes, they both imply the romanticization of a potentially dangerous person to some extent. It’s possible that fans of Ascended Astarion attract more attention due to the obvious symbolism of power and its imbalance, but that doesn’t mean the spawn route is less romanticized in its essence. Both endings represent different facets of the same character, and attachment to one version is not necessarily more "justified" than to the other. Some romanticize him as vulnerable and seeking redemption, while others see his dark potential and ambition for power. In both cases, the perception of the character remains subjective, and it is unfair to assert that one form of romanticization is more acceptable than the other. In my opinion, again subjective, ignoring his dark sides in favor of the idea of "redemption" can create a distorted image of the character, where his darker tendencies are downplayed and undervalued for the sake of his potential "salvation."

But it's always only the fans of Ascended Astarion who often face concerns about their mental health and claims that such fantasies supposedly push women to choose abusive partners in real life. But by that logic, the spawn route ending is also a dangerous fantasy when applied to reality.

Thus, by following the "good" path, we willingly bind ourselves to a potentially dangerous partner who can kill us several times throughout the game, yet we continue to believe that we can fix or heal him with love, friendship, and support, and that he will ultimately reveal a different, better side of himself. This is literally the mentality of abuse victims: they see the deeply hidden "kindness" behind the aggressive facade and believe they can awaken it and change the person for the better. It is this faith in the "healing" of the abuser that prevents them from leaving.

But it is obvious that there is a profound divide between the world of fantasy and reality, and what works within the framework of a fictional story should not be applied to everyday life. Fantasies in games, books, or movies allow us to safely experience complex and idealized situations, immersing ourselves in roles and scenarios that can be destructive or dangerous in real life. For no fan of Ascended Astarion does this story serve as a basis for real beliefs or behavioral models in real life.

But I have seen some fans of the spawn route sincerely claim that Astarion evokes a sense of safety for them due to his status as a victim of sexual violence, which resonates with many women's experiences and personal experiences of abuse. This statement raises questions, especially when it comes to a character who can kill you when you try to help him. And if you do not want to help him, he may manipulate you into doing so.

The entire romance with Astarion is a romanticization of a walking red flag.

A romance with Astarion offers several ways to experience fantasy, and it would be hypocritical to judge it from a real-world perspective solely in the evil route. Like the "I can fix him" trope, the storyline with Ascended Astarion allows the player to explore certain psychological and emotional aspects.

Ultimately, characters like Astarion are designed to be ambiguous. All fans of Astarion, in one way or another, are involved in the process of romanticization, as they choose the path that resonates most closely with their personal preferences.

Fantasies about salvation through love are a normal occurrence in artistic works and fantasy settings, but is it fair to demand that fans of Ascended Astarion "take off their rose-colored glasses"? I am convinced that fans of Ascended Astarion have a much more sober view of the character, at least recognizing the dark side of Astarion and accepting it as a fundamental part of his character rather than as a mere byproduct of trauma.

The argument that "the romanticization of abuse in games encourages people to choose abusive relationships in real life" sounds as absurd as the claim that "shooters provoke people to commit real murders." Following this logic, one could accuse any stories that address complex or dark themes of allegedly romanticizing or promoting dangerous or socially unacceptable phenomena. For example, an intimate scene with Halsin in bear form could be perceived as romanticizing zoophilia since it is portrayed in a positive light if one ignores the entire context and forgets that it is fiction. However, it is clear that this scene is created for humor.

I truly believe that many of those who accuse fans of Ascended Astarion of romanticization hardly realize how deeply they themselves are immersed in it. There is nothing fair in these accusations, especially considering the source from which they come.