100% Correct

I have found the original HD size of the extended aspects from 4archive

this is a repost, I only reposted this because I think the original creator has deactivated their Tumblr. If by some chance the original creator messages me, I will take this post down.

Since I do not trust Tumblr to not destroy the image quality I will post this on Imgur. here

Classpect powers and skill

So I was thinking about god-tier abilities in Homestuck, and it struck me that rather a lot of the so-called “classpect powers” showcased in hs are either A: a more “supernatural” expression of something the person in question had already been doing prior, or, rarely, B: a direct response to a previously established problem. And in aggregate, these feel like they point toward a fairly particular conception of classpect abilities, that of skills that are learned (or levelups gained in a special ability, if we want to get video gamey with it).

Let’s use John as an example. As the predominant early viewpoint character, his growth is fairly well detailed. As he enters his Land and starts properly growing, he goes from using the Breeze to send objects across his Land using the Parcel Pyxis network, to subconsciously summoning the Breeze to save himself from a fire, to subconsciously having the Breeze emanate in massive quantities from his very body to put out the planet-spanning Green Tragedy, to finally as a god-tier (and with some valuable advice from Vriska) taking full control of the Breeze and using it as a tool and weapon. All of these fall into the A category, but John also has two solid B category abilities, the ability to resist detection via scent, and the ability to turn into wind to protect himself against attacks. And both those abilities are perfect for protection against Bec Noir, who tracked John down via his scent and stabbed him in the chest shortly before John god-tiered, at which point he immediately gained the first of these abilities (he showcased the second when fighting Noir in the Furthest Ring later).

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This time we dig into Gamzee’s recurring links to the masks of Comedy and Tragedy, historical worship of the Greek god of Theatre, Dionysus, and what all of this tells us about Gamzee’s arc and, potentially, even the Rage aspect.

Today’s question is: Can you think of other trolls with strong ties to figures in Greecoroman/Egyptian/Judeo-Christian mythologies?

You can find links to sources & support the project at: https://www.patreon.com/optimisticDuelist

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I got inspired by a theory I found from this post however I disagreed with some of their choices...so I made my own version of an aspect breakdown.

Space is divided into Start and Place, which is further divided into Stir and Flux for the former and Scope and Vast for the latter. Stir was inspired by the primordial soup from which all life began and flux was honestly due to my playing overwatch too much but also has to do with gravity itself. Scope and Vast kind of go hand in hand and deal with spatial dimensions.

Time is split into Stream, for the flow of time itself. The MSPA reader saying that "time is like a river" gave me this idea. Eon is the other half of time. Stream breaks down into Hint to represent how any moment can cause an entire timeline to diverge into an offshoot, and into Trend which signifies how once a timeline becomes doomed things just get worse and worse. Eon goes into Bide since we've always had moments where we've had to bide our time, and Stop because once a timeline is over, it's done.

Light is divided into Bright and Lot. Bright is then divided into Flash and Warm which are really self explanatory. Lot (as in "casting lots") is broken into Grasp (as in grasping information) and Odds (they can be good or bad)

Void is broken down into Still (like the still puddle in the image) and Dark. Still then turns into Depth and Hide. Dark turns into Fog and Shade. I feel these are self explanatory, but if anyone wants me to go into them, I'm open to any questions.

Life is Grow and Romp. Grow becomes Sprout (who hasn't noticed tiny little green shoots out of the ground when spring comes?) and Pluck (for who but the young are so full of energy and Life?) Also good for a reference to the webcomic itself (lad/lass scamper, pluck). Romp (a word for playing or being at play) turns into Wild and Vim. Animals play all the time and life keeps going even after we try and tear it down.

Doom becomes Curb and Grind. Curb (think like how the curb keeps a car from crashing into innocent pedestrians) turns into Rule (for rules and laws keep us from running Wild-get it?) and Yield (for we all must submit to things we don't want to do for the greater good). Chose the picture of the stigmata because well tbh I am still a Christian and because it fits. Grind (like how gamers grind to get better at what they do) goes down into Sift (sifting the good from the bad) and Trim (as in trimming overgrown leaves and branches).

Breath is Move and Sound. Move then is Rush (running so fast you can feel the wind on your face) and Lift (because then you can fly). Sound becomes Din (the noise, noise, noise) and Tell (because sound and thus voices carry through air).

Blood is diluted (get it? cause it's liquid?) into Yoke ("we are equally yoked") and Trust (in order to accomplish bigger things). Yoke turns into Serve and Vow. I know that marriage vows aren't the only kind of vow, but I thought the picture fit best. Trust turns into Touch and Lead.

Heart (my own aspect!) is Pith and Whim. Pith is the core of something (for example, the pith of a fruit) and whim-because who hasn't ever done something on a whim? Pith is then divided into Self and Groove. (We all have our own self and groove) Whim becomes sway and mood, because moods can sway us to act one way or another.

With Mind I agreed with @wakraya in that it was Will and Thought. However for me, Will then becomes Seek and Delve. Thought becomes Plan and Mull. If you notice, I left a tiny reference to Terezi in way of the icons-none of them have open eyes.

Hope, to me, is Yearn and Dare. We all yearn for better things, but only some of us dare to take that first step. Yearn turns into Dream (not dreams like the space aspect pushed too far) but to dream at night and during the day when we want more, and into Grace. This is where I think the whole "physical attraction" part of Hope players comes in. Dare breaks down into Fun and Wish. Yes, this means I believe that Hope is inherently magical, or that magic itself is a part of the Hope aspect. That, or (if you believe that magic is fake like Eridan does) that advanced enough science/technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Rage is broken down into Fume and Shun. Fume (to be angry in silence) turns into Spur and Force. Since Rage is doing the opposite of just Hoping, I feel these subcategories are accurate. Shun turns into Warn (of danger) and Fear (think of the fight or flight or freeze or fawn response in nature. To fawn is when one tries to please in order to mitigate danger.)

This took me about a day to make but I had a bunch of fun doing it and figuring out how to break down each Aspect. Hit me up if you have any questions or comments! (I also want to credit the person behind the original theory, but they aren't on tumblr anymore.)

HEIR OF MIND

PRIMARY: PHYSICAL SECONDARY: CONCEPTUAL

Primaries and Secondaries are how a player’s powers manifest. Physical primaries mean they manifest physically and manifest conceptually as a secondary.

ABILITIES

JOSEPH JOESTAR

Heirs of Mind have an uncanny ability to follow someone's thought process easily. This can make them amazing friends or eerie people who always seem to be able to see through others.

PROFILER

In line with being able to follow someone's train of thought, Heirs of Mind are able to metaphorically step in a person's mind should they put in the effort. A more literal version of this ability can be used as a spell.

AMBIENT ABILITIES

As an Heir, this class has ambient, uncontrollable abilities as every other Heir does. This is because Heir classes are served and protected by their aspect, meaning Heirs of Mind are naturally protected by Mind.

ANGEL RADIO

Heirs of Mind may accidentally pick up stray thoughts, especially those pertaining to wishing them harm so they may avoid it.

THINK OF ME FONDLY

When in danger, enemies may suddenly find themselves thinking positively of an Heir of Mind.

CUE CARD

In battle, an Heir of Mind may pick up on opponents strategies eerily fast; a physical version of JOSEPH JOESTAR.

STARTER SPELLS

Any spell this class can use at Level One, including but not limited to:

I THINK THEREFORE I AM - the ability to actually assume the mind of someone else, EXTREMELY disorienting.

SIMON SAYS - Jedi mind trick. Yeah.

HORROR GAME TAPES - the ability to infuse memories into items, allowing Heirs of Mind to deliver vital information to party members.

TELEPATHY - the ability to communicate with someone through thoughts - if the creature thinks, telepathy works.

THRALL - A cross between SIMON SAYS and TELEPATHY, controlling someone's actions by beaming thoughts into their heads.

offensive vs defensive

my mage of life friend mentioned something off handedly that i had never noticed before, and i’m pretty sure it puts a hole in the “but passive classes fight stuff!” rebuttal i usually get when talking about -/+ classes.

they DO fight… just not using their powers!

how does john egbert attack?

with a hammer!

but what happens when HE’S attacked?

he uses breath! or rather, he’s supplied with breath. you get the idea though.

when compared against vriska, an active class, john primarily uses his powers for defense.

while vriska’s specibus itself depends on her using her powers primarily for offense!

like everything involving the passive/active dichotomy, this will be based on inclination/preference rather than an absolute rule. and there are definitely things that go against these guidelines, like roxy mostly using her void powers during [s] collide and rose continuing to use her wands after god tiering (though they’re echidna’s quills, so they might be different? i’m pretty sure they channel light though?). but it mostly holds up i think.

The Distinction Between Light and Rage (With Some Gushers)

One of the things I’ve seen come up in discussion about the aspects is some overlaps between them to varying degrees. One good example of this Light and Rage.  I think it’s pretty much consensus at this point that Rage = Truth or Revelations. But it gets really interesting when talking about Light because Light also presides over the concept of truth. Some people have tried to smooth over the similarities by saying that Rage is “emotional truths” or truths that make you feel bad, but I think it’s a bit more complex than that. I think the distinction between the two is as follows: Ragebounds are “correct” and Lightbounds are “right”. Generally speaking? What do I mean by this?  Well, for the sake of this post, I am defining “correct” as presenting facts or evidence, and being “Right” is possessing an understanding of the facts in such a way that allows one to provide new insights, or form new arguments. Ragebounds are a deconstructive aspect, as the Extended Zodiac states. 

The “true” objective reality that Ragebounds seeks is noted to be covered up by “lies” (something Hope would preside over as Hope is an aspect of illusions, and beliefs). For the rage bound, the truth is something that must already exist and is being covered up, and their primary goal is to rip and tear things to find their irreducibles. The cold hard facts.  The Extended Zodiac paints Lightbounds as the exact opposite in this regard: 

Where Ragebound pursue the facts to destroy faulty arguments, Lightbounds pursue facts to form new arguments. The EZ funnily describes them as “alchemists” linking them to the Sburb Mechanics of Alchemy, which utilizes a resource called “Grist” (which is substance used to back up an argument). 

The limitation of Lightbound’s relationship with Truth and a Ragebound’s is that a Lightbound constructs new perspectives, arguments, and grants themselves more options while eliminating the bad or unwise ones. Ragebounds use their evidence to deconstruct arguments and systems and get to the heart of the matter. But don’t ask them for solutions any fallouts or results of radical behavior. The end result being anarchy/confusion. “What the heck are we supposed to believe now?” everyone shouts. This dynamic may be in part influenced by their neighboring aspects Mind and Doom.  Light sits across from Mind on the EZ potentially indicating that some elements of Mind’s options, and lack of bias are carried over. Conversely, Doom is across from Rage indicating the limitation and narrowing down of options that Ragebounds experience as they discover and move towards the truth. 

Not an Enigma, and Certainly Not a Curse: the "Ultimate Self" in Hussie's Own Words

I've found myself, lately, in several conversations in a row where the other guy and myself weren't on the same page about what the Ultimate Self meant; and though I welcome the opportunity for discussion, explaining my position over and over again has cost me minutes of my screen life that I simply won't win back. So this post is a departure from my usual fare in that it's more for my own benefit than that of anybody else.

I've been over Davepeta's "superceding bodyless and timeless persona that crosses the boundaries of paradox space" enough already, so if you're interested in the Ultimate Self as it is in Homestuck, I recommend you read "Homestuck's Gnosticism: The Conflict", and then, if that piques your attention, you continue with the follow-up "The World/The Wheel". For the purposes of this post, though, I want to keep analysis, interpretation and hypothesising to a minimum. As the title indicates, this is the Ultimate Self not as I describe it, or as characters describe it, but - so to speak - straight from the horse's mouth.

In Andrew Hussie's commentary on Homestuck: Book 6, p. 312:

Oftentimes, when characters lose certain qualities that came to define them, there's this sense of liberation they seem to experience. They become a happier, more relieved, easier-going version of themselves. When Aradia ditches a defining quality we came to know her by (being dead), she becomes a much happier and self-actualized Aradia. Sollux also seems to be chilling out now that his defining properties (bifurcation, etc.) have been KO'd. He had a mouth full of gnarly teeth that gave him a wicked lisp (gone), eyes full of nasty laser beams (gone, along with his eyesight), and a brain full of doomsday visions and bipolar disorder (also gone—well, maybe not the bipolar thing, because that's probably not how that works, but whatever). You get more of this kind of thing in even higher degrees with some of the fusion stuff that happens later (Arquius, Davepeta), where characters become almost euphoric versions of themselves for having been completely liberated from certain self-limitations which previously defined them. The concept of an "ultimate self," which appears much later, probably has its roots way back to stuff like this, which got the ball rolling on the idea that a more complete or fulfilled self is one that becomes free from mortal limitations, or the idiosyncrasies which comprise a specific instance of one version of yourself. Hence an ultimate self is an aggregate of someone's full potential. It's not just doing away with negative traits, but summing up all iterations of yourself, including ones without those traits, allowing you to move beyond them. Or maybe more accurately, to view them as insignificant in the grand totality of what a person really is.

Importantly, what Hussie does here is draw the conceptual line from the themes of Acts 1-5 to what are often interpreted by some as radically different, even left-field themes through Act 6. Think of this as an extension of one of Homestuck's meta-themes, where the comic undergoes a series of escalations that take simple conflicts to their logical extremes: we start the story worried about a Reckoning which might destroy the Earth, then end up with the more pressing concern that a Rapture is about to end reality as we know it. The Ultimate Self is the end result of the exact same kind of escalation; where the God Tiers are a method of becoming a better version of oneself by merging with one's "ideal" dream body, the Ultimate Self is the logical conclusion that one can become the best version by unifying with every body.

To draw my own conceptual line back to Homestuck: Book 5, page 409:

This connects to the basic question of whether to embrace the regimentation of a heroic path conveniently laid out for you (the expectation), or to reject it as the shallow and rigid confinement of personal destiny (the deviation). These issues are expressed through the fundamental language of platonic idealism: perfect ideas of things, and then specific, imperfect instances of those ideas, or varied permutations, evolutions, or hacks of those ideas through alchemy. The way Sburb "should" go is an ideal (expectation), but the disastrous, chaotic way it actually goes is an imperfect instance (deviation). An "idea" of a person, such as Rose, along with her regimented heroic quest for growth, and all the great things she might imagine herself to become if she followed it, is an ideal (expectation). The messy, flawed, yet more genuinely human individual she does become resulting from her errant choices and rejection of formalism, is an imperfect instance of an ideal (deviation). What's the bottom line here? This is a lot. I know it's a lot. Homestuck is, in fact, a lot.

I've added some of my own emphasis there again, but that whole extract is worth reading. The reason I bolded that part is because this "Platonic idealism" is something Hussie talks about a lot in his commentary, and I think that commentary is essential reading for anyone who wants to even get their foot in the door on this topic. Again, this is something I've blogged about extensively already, so there's more than just Hussie's word to take for it if you're really interested; but for the sake of this post, I'll finish off with, again, what Hussie himself has to say on the matter, all the way back in Homestuck: Book 1, page 123:

With things like Athenums and Perfectly Generic Objects locked and loaded, Sburb architecture seems to be circling widely around a game abstraction-based systemization of Platonic idealism. Homestuck deals with what I am going to roughly characterize as THEMES.

I just had an epiphany on the Breath aspect, and how intricately it connects to the concept of ghosts/the afterlife

Heir of Doom

PRIMARY: CONCEPTUAL

SECONDARY: PHYSICAL

Primaries and Secondaries are how a player’s powers manifest. Conceptual primaries mean they manifest conceptually and manifest physically as a secondary.

ABILITIES

INJURY SINK

Not so much an ability but a physical feature (or a bug, depending on who you’re talking to) - Heirs of Doom, due to their nature of inheriting demise, often have frail health. They bruise easier than most and break bones faster, but because of a lifetime of having to deal with constant pain, they have a ridiculously high pain tolerance which cancels out their injurious nature.

CHEMICALBLOOD

Also due to the inheritor nature of the Heir of Doom, they often have a high tolerance of drugs, alcohol or other substances that may dampen or enhance their senses. Their body immediately begins to break down the substances in alarmingly fast speeds, which means that while they’re not immune to these things, they have to consume/be dealt with large amounts of them. 

IMAGINE DRAGONS

When in danger, or when afraid, an Heir of Doom can go radioactive in order to eliminate surrounding threats. As such, they themselves are immune to radiation. It is still not recommended for Heirs of Doom to go around eating glowing radioactive rocks despite the fact that it will do nothing to them.

RACCOON

If the Heir has to resort to physical violence and feels as if they are in danger, they can go rabid and infect someone if they bite them. At any other moment, however, they will show negative in rabies tests.

AMBIENT ABILITIES

As an Heir, this class has ambient, uncontrollable abilities as every other Heir does. This is because Heir classes are served and protected by their aspect, meaning Heirs of Doom are naturally protected by Doom.

MISFORTUNATE

As Heirs of Doom inherit Doom, they have unnaturally bad luck and tend to attract danger, both in the form of people and coincidence. Their high pain tolerance helps them get through their accidents / physical injuries, while their Cosmic Monster helps ward off their physical threats. Their Danger Sense helps them minimize and survive their bad luck.

DANGER SENSE

As Heirs of Doom are naturally protected by Doom, they often have hunches of where and when something bad will happen. It doesn’t always work - often only coming up when the danger will result in their death - but it is always right. The specificity of this sense gets more precise the closer and worse the danger, and the higher the Heir’s level is. Their Danger Sense is the conceptual manifestation of their ‘protected by Doom’ clause.

COSMIC MONSTER

Due to the fact that Heirs of Doom are protected by Doom, the most dangerous person in their session is often metaphysically linked to them and forced to protect them, drawn in by hunches and an emotional attachment manufactured by the cosmic bond. If there is no person dangerous enough, then their classpect will attempt to find something else, like an adversary. If this is also unavailable (especially while the Heir is still progressing through the ranks and hasn’t encountered anything sufficiently dangerous), their aspect will generate its own Cosmic Monster creature, often reflective of the Heir’s personality. The sentience of this Monster depends on the Heir’s personality. 

If an Heir’s protector is eliminated, Cosmic Monster will immediately look for a replacement. If the Heir is continuously exposed to danger and cycles through protectors too quickly, a creature will be generated for their own safety. This creature is linked intrinsically to their magic.

KINETICS

When taking physical blows, Heirs of Doom have the natural ability to convert damage into strength. The stronger the hits, the stronger the Heir gets.

STARTER SPELLS

Any spell this class can use at Level One, including but not limited to:

NULLIFY - the ability to nullify magic. At level one, the range of this nullification is localized to the Heir, but at higher levels, they can expand their nullification field.

TECHNOKINESIS - since Doom governs processes, technology and systems, Heirs of Doom have technokinesis. At low levels, this technokinesis manifests as being able to manipulate software or machines without touching them, but at higher levels it allows them to fully link themselves with the machine or software, similar to being Drift Compatible with it.

DECAY - the easiest spell in the Heir of Doom’s repertoire. If the Heir touches an object, it rots and decays, making it an effective combat spell, with the downside of needing close contact.

REAPER

Similar to how Heart Players have Stands, and Rage Players have Berserkers, Doom Players have a magical state unique to them called Reaper, which is essentially a power-up state that physically changes a Doom player’s appearance alongside the massive rise in magical power. Reapers differ from player to player, and though  some classifications share names, they often look different due to player personalities and magical level.

Some Reapers are class-locked due to their nature.

AZRAEL Archangel of Death

In this state, an Heir of Doom can curse / condemn targets to death, which will result in misfortune after misfortune until death catches up to them. They can attempt to outrun it, but it will keep hounding them Final Destination style, and eventually catch up to them. The danger of this ability is that it is not only limited to the current fight but will last until the end of the targets’ life. This state also opens the Heir’s senses to Death, which makes them sense if someone is injured or ailing, who’s dead or who is close to death. 

Please do not touch the Azrael reaper mode, as their body is made of pure death and touching them would either make your limbs decay or kill you on the spot. In this state, any spell or object that hits the Azrael reaper mode automatically decays said spell or object.

Please note that Azrael is a classification, not the name of a person’s Reaper. Players often name their Reaper based on personal preference.